On December 15 Jim Pfost met with Hetal Desai, the Assistant City Attorney and Richard Courtemanche, Jr., Asst. City Attorney/Police Legal Advisor handling the Chez Pierre noise complaints. As you can see from the explanation below, when arrived Mr. Pfost was informed that they had met with David Michael Sprowles earlier.
Ms. Desai told me that Mr. Sprowles advised her that all of the neighborhood association demands of him were met, they are no longer contracting the louder bands such as Crooked Shoos, and the music has been toned down. I told her there are definitely two sides to every story and that Chez Pierre has not met any of the demands outlined in the minutes of the May 23, 2008 meeting….especially hiring a sound dampering company to look into ways to keep the music on the premises and also making sure the bands keep the sound down as evidenced by the number of police complaints recently filed.
Ms. Desai advised me that the City Attorney’s office will continue to monitor the situation. But, since the noise issue is subjective and the decibel levels have not been high when tested by the police department after receiving complaints, there is little she can at this time. She was asked whether the 2Chez deck and bar being built without building permits could be tied into the noise issue as leverage. She says that is a whole different story and will be handled separately.
At this point, Ms. Desai says that if individuals in the neighborhood are still bothered by loud music, she would like them to continue filing police department complaints. She will monitor the complaints and get involved further if necessary. But other than that, she says individuals will have to file private civil lawsuits if they are still unhappy at this point.
Dear City Commissioners Andrew, Debbie, Bob and Mayor John:My name is Ed Gray and I live on Williams St. just on the south side of Lafayette Park. This morning my wife and I decided to take advantage of all the development in our neighborhood and walk the three blocks to Manor at Midtown for a cup of coffee. I was quickly reminded why this is something we rarely do: it is a totally harrowing experience. Thomasville Road, as you all know, has become one of the city’s heaviest traveled roads. This would not be a problem were there a reasonable place to cross the road but there is not. The closest crosswalk to our house is at sixth avenue, but to ge there means we have to walk about a half of a mile and then back track to the businesses we seek to patronize. I might even be inclined to go to midtown manor with my kids but given the hazards would never consider doing so on foot.I realize that the city is unlikely to act on behalf of the smal constituency that lives in the Lafayette Park neighborhood. But as the mid-town corridor continues to expand, with more businesses and bars and restaurants, what is an inconvenience for area residents is liable to become a very serious liability for all parties: the city, the county, and the businesses. This is an extremely dangerous situation and will only become more dangerous with the new properties being developed. The city has to address this problem before it is too late and somebody is hit by a car (there have already been a number of accidents in the area) trying to reach Whattaburger or the Coffee Pub by daring to cross Thomasville Road in the absence of a crosswalk.
As I say, my concern goes beyond merely facilitating the kind of pedestrian circulation the city and the neighborhood so desires. It is a matter of public safety and it is an urgent matter.
Thanks for your help with this.
Best wishes,
Ed Gray
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Edward G. Gray
Editor, Common-place
Professor of History
Department of History
Florida State University
Tallahassee, FL 32306-2200
(850) 644-1627
Fax (850) 644-6402
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AA CENTER MEETING NOTES July 14, 2008
This will confirm that a meeting took place at the AA Center, 909 N. Gadsden in Tallahassee, Florida on Monday, July 14, 2008 as follow up to the June 16, 2008 meeting with Talla-Con, Inc regarding parking, noise and other issues. Present at the meeting were Jeff Dinert, Stan Parsons & Jud Orrick, board members of Talla-Con, Rob Kenyon of Intergroup 5 the AA North Florida service organization, Andrea Griffin and Debra Thomas from the Tallahassee Neighborhood Services, Tallahassee Police Officer Ryan Dunohy, Chief Code Enforcement Inspector Ann Randolph, Captain Tim McCown, Lt. Freeman Davis & Maurice Majszak of the Tallahassee Fire Department, neighbors Bob Davis, David Mitchell, Lafayette Park Neighborhood Association Board members and neighbors, Alexa Roche & Ed Gray and Jim Pfost, president of the LPNA. OPENING Everyone present introduced themselves so that the group was informed who was attending this follow up meeting. Jim Pfost wished to make it very clear again that Alcoholics Anonymous is not the issue in this matter. Thank yous were extended to the Talla Con members and especially to Jeff Dinert for the tremendous effort and progress that has been made on the parking and noise issues. The issues & neighborhood desires discussed at the last meeting were: (1) Members causing parking problems on Williams, Cherry or McDaniel Streets. The neighborhood asked that the members only park in the 24 spaces on Gadsden Street near Lafayette Park and on streets to the west side of Gadsden or in commercial parking lots found by Talla-Con. (2) The Center was asked to move some Central Group members to other facilities (churches, community centers, etc.) to cut down on the large numbers coming to 909 N. Gadsden to help cut down on noise and trash problems. (3) Eliminate one or more meeting times a day and especially eliminate early morning and the 8:15pm meeting since they cause the most noise and disturbance. (4) They will better educate their members about neighbor etiquette and how to be better neighbors to the area residents. (5) There were also questions posed about what the fire department building occupancy capacity is allowed per meeting in the Center and what is the on-site parking space requirement given the occupancy allowed in the house. NEIGHBOR COMMENTS~~ Several neighbors attended the meeting and voiced their happiness as to the progress made to date as well as some continued concerns. Ed Gray stated he was very pleased with the work the Center has done in this passed month. The parking problems on Williams Street & Cherry Streets have improved 100%, the trash issues have been resolved and noise is at a minimum. Bob Davis stated he was still a “doubting Thomas”…. Because things may be good now does not mean they will be good a year from now. He feels the laws regarding building seating capacity opposed to the required parking spaces for these numbers are in conflict and need attention by the City. An established capacity of the building is required and occupancy signs are needed. He says there is an issue with fire department trucks getting into the neighborhood due to confusion caused by the Shelley Glen alley. Alexa Roche and David Mitchell stated that the early morning meetings are still the most problematical but felt that a very good job was being done to eliminate the parking, noise and trash problems. And, -Kyndra Light, 913. N Gadsden who was not at the meeting but provided this email message:James is working a job in Capitola on Monday and I don’t have anyone to watch Lukas so I will not be able to attend the meeting on Monday. I would like to say that there has been a drastic improvement with the parking and noise situation. James and I are very pleased with the results thus far and only time will tell if these changes remain in effect. Our only remaining issue is concerning the early morning meetings. Every morning, during the week, cars drive through the driveway, people are slamming doors and talking and it never fails to wake up Lukas. This is quite a problem as sleep is a precious commodity in this household and will be even more so after the arrival of our little girl in August. If members could simply keep their parking to the back parking lot and not park (or have loud conversations) in the driveway right outside of the windows, it would be a tremendous help. This of course only need apply to the early morning meeting, I understand that they need the driveway for parking during more crowded meeting times. Please let me know if there are any questions, we will stay in touch and best of progress during the meeting on Monday! TALLA-CON, INC AND INTERGROUP 5 RESPONSE~~Jeff Dinert has arranged for about 85 additional parking for members to use off-site in parking lots owned by Thasher Law Firm, Florida Police Chiefs Association, Tallahassee Board of Realtors, Moore Bass Consulting and Newell, Terry & Douglas, PA. Jim Pfost of the LPNA will send thank you letters to each of these entities for their cooperation and help in solving the parking issues.Rob Kenyon stated he has made maps of the area so members will know where and where not to park. He has made continuing announcements not to park on Williams, Cherry and McDaniels Streets. He assures the neighbors that announcements will be made every meeting so that a year from now there will continue to be no parking, noise or trash problems.Jud Orrick stated that the number of meetings per day and per week have increased over the years but they always had meeting every day. Although there are frustrations over a lot of issues, he is please with the progress made by Jeff Dinert. He said normally early morning meeting only has 30 people attending. Stanley Parsons says they are having a contest amongst the members to be good neighbors. He also wrote the following in an email: I am pleased with the response from both our neighbors and the folks that use our facilities to our efforts to address the four concerns you brought to us last month. I have been monitoring the parking and the change has been nothing short of profound. The commitment to continue the effort strong (something I have not felt in the past). I attribute it largely to Jeff. Arrangements have been made for alternate parking at night and on the weekends. The support we have received from the neighbors with lots has been unanimous and Williams Street is virtually empty during the week. The two cars parked on Williams last Sunday at noon were folks that had not gotten the word. There are folks talking about starting new meetings at new locations, particularly mid day alternatives on the weekends. Time will tell. CITY DEPARTMENT INPUT~~ Andrea Griffin of the Tallahassee Neighborhood Service Department said the although the property may be grand fathered into the neighborhood, the usage by the the AA Center has expanded from the original intent and there may issues of safety and other problems that need to be resolved. She asked Ann Randolph, the Chief Code Enforcement Inspector of the City Growth Department and Captain Tim McCown of the Tallahassee Fire Department to inspect the building and premises. Captain McCown stated that he, Freeman Davis and Maurice Majszak of the Fire Department would conduct an occupancy limit, check for fire violation issues, etc immediately following the meeting and would provide the results of their findings to Andrea Griffin to be shared with the group. Ann Randolph of Code Enforcement says that the AA Center is a legal non conforming entity and the AA can use the structure for their meetings as long as the structure stays the same size and is not changed. She stated that the Mid-Town area parking problems are not an issue involving the Center. She will inspect the building for code violations and provide her report to Andrea Griffin. OTHER~~ There was a discussion amongst the group as the to the parking related issues caused by the Mid–Town Merchants area and new businesses being scheduled to be built there. Ann Randolph suggested contacting the Growth Management Planning Department to see what was required of the new businesses and expansion of Kool Beanz in relation to their seating capacities and the parking requirements. I was able to talk with Capt. McCown and Lt. Davis after their inspection. The seating capacity of the large front room of the Center is 78 people and the back meeting room has a capacity of 20 people. The capacity is figured by taking the square footage of each area less the aisles and divide by 7. If you feel that there are corrections or additions to be made to these notes, please contact Jim Pfost. |
AA CENTER MEETING NOTES This will confirm that a meeting took place at the AA Center, 909 N. Gadsden in Tallahassee, Florida on Monday, June 16, 2008 as follow up to the June 4, 2008 Lafayette Park Neighborhood Association letter directed to the landlord Talla-Con, Inc regarding parking, noise and other issues.
Present at the meeting were Jeff Dinert & Stan Parsons, board members of Talla-Con, Rob Kenyon of Intergroup 5 the AA North Florida service organization, Andrea Griffin and Debra Thomas from the Tallahassee Neighborhood Services, Ross Airom from City Traffic Engineering, Tallahassee Police Officer Ryan Dunohy, Kevin Carey a representative of City Commissioner Mark Mustian, Jennifer Portman of the Tallahassee Democrat, neighbors Bob Davis, David Mitchell, Jim Roche, James & Kyndra Light, Lafayette Park Neighborhood Association Board members and neighbors, Alexa Roche & Ed Gray and Jim Pfost, president of the LPNA.
Invited but not present were the chairperson of the AA Central Group, Talla-Con president Jud Orrick , City Commissioner Debbie Lightsey and the police department area commander Lt. Dewey Riou.
OPENING STATEMENT~~
Jim Pfost wished to make it very clear that Alcoholics Anonymous is not the issue in this matter. AA is a very good organization that has helped millions of men and women in this country and worldwide to improve their lives and become more responsible and useful members of society.
We realize this house located at 909 N. Gadsden has been used as an AA clubhouse for over 44 years and for many years was a good quiet neighbor. But, the real issue is that things have changed the last 3-4 years. There has been a very large increase in the numbers coming to the Center. The members meeting at the Center are called the “Central Group” which rents the hall from the landlord, Talla-Con, Inc and there are also several court directed individuals coming to this Center. Meeting times have expanded from two meetings a day three days a week a few years ago to four meetings a day seven days a week. The Center’s parking lot only holds 12 vehicles. The house that is located within the Lafayette Park Neighborhood is obviously too small for the large number of members attending meetings. This creates parking problems that in turn cause disturbances to this neighborhood including noise, trash problems, blocked private driveways and people lingering in the area after the meetings. NEIGHBORHOOD CONCERNS~~ Several homeowners and neighbors in the area attended the meeting and voiced their concerns. Bob Davis recited a history of the parking problems and distributed a copy of a letter he had written to the AA Center on August 21, 2005 about these concerns that went unanswered by anyone from Tall-Con or the Central Group. He stated that the letter did prompt the City Traffic Engineering Department to add 24 parking spaces on Gadsden Street near Lafayette Park. James and Kyndra Light voiced problems involving noise from vehicles and motorcycles driving into the Centers parking lot, loud talking and cursing before and after meetings, members parking in their driveway and illegal parking in front of their home. They have called the police department several times over the past year to report these problems. James, who is a building contractor, cited code violations involving the AA Center structure. Alexa Roche stated that after many meetings trash is left by members in regular places along Williams Street, there are continual problems of members blocking she and Jim Roche’s driveway and there is a problem of members running the stop signs on Williams Street. Ed Gray and David Mitchell both voiced concerns about the parking issues on Williams and Cherry Streets and the safety issues the large numbers of cars are causing. There were also questions posed about what the fire department building occupancy capacity is allowed per meeting in the Center and what is the on-site parking space requirement given the occupancy allowed in the house. CITY DEPARTMENT INPUT~~ Andrea Griffin and Debra Thomas of the Tallahassee Neighborhood Service Department said they would get the Planning Department and Growth Management Departments involved to answer questions about the building occupancy limits and parking requirements. Ross Airom of Traffic Engineering stated that there are definite parking issues and safety issues that need to be addressed. He said that even though the house may be grand fathered into the neighborhood, many code requirements and safety requirements still have to be followed and cannot be overlooked by the landlord. Officer Ryan Dunphy of the Tallahassee Police Department was asked to have police patrols in the area to crack down on parking, speeding and stop sign violations, especially at the AA Center daily noon meeting. NEIGHBORHOOD DESIRES There were several points made as to what the neighbors would like to see happen involving the non profit incorporated landlord, Talla-Con, Inc and the AA Central group. (1) Their first desire is see the AA vacate and move from 909 N. Gadsden to a more commercial location or church. If this does not happen quickly or does not occur at all, the neighbors would like the following to be done: (2) Ask that their members not park on Williams, Cherry or McDaniel Streets and only park in the 24 spaces on Gadsden Street near Lafayette Park and on streets to the west side of Gadsden or in commercial parking lots found by Talla-Con. (3) Move some Central Group members to other facilities (churches, community centers, etc.) to cut down on the large numbers coming to 909 N. Gadsden. (4) Eliminate one or more meeting times a day and especially eliminate Sunday meetings and the 8:15pm meeting since they cause the most noise and disturbance. Talla-Con has offered Kyndra & James Light to build an 8-10 foot high block wall between the Center and their home. The Lights do not want such a wall that would block out 7 windows on the south side of their home.
TALLA-CON, INC AND INTERGROUP 5 RESPONSE
Talla-Con, Inc and Intergroup 5 Response
Jeff Dinert, the newly appointed president of Talla-Con and board member Stan Parsons as well Rob Kenyon, the area coordinator for the AA Service Organization agreed to the following: (1) They will better educate their members about neighbor etiquette and how to be better neighbors to the area residents. (2) They will instruct the members to not park on Williams, Cherry or McDaniel Streets or anywhere else within the Lafayette Park Neighborhood. (3) They will start looking for alternate commercial parking areas so the parking problems are not just shifted or transferred from the Lafayette Park Neighborhood to another area. (4) They will look for ways to move some of their members to other AA groups or meetings in order to reduce the large numbers of members meeting at 909 N. Gadsden Street. (5) They will look into ways to eliminate some of the meeting times and possibly move the Sunday meeting to another location.(6) They will look into the possibility of relocating and selling the 909 N. Gadsden location. NEXT MEETING DATE~~ There will be a follow up meeting at 2:00pm on Monday, July14, 2008 at 909 N. Gadsden. It is an open meeting and anyone interest is invited to attend. If you feel that there are corrections or additions to be made to these notes, please contact Jim Pfost.CHEZ PIERRE/2CHEZ
| This will confirm that a meeting took place at he Chez Pierre Restaurant on Thursday, June 12, 2008 as follow up to the music and parking issues outlined in the Lafayette Park Neighborhood Association letter dated May 23, 2008 to Chez Pierre.Present at this meeting were David-Michael Sprowles co-owner/manager of Chez Pierre, Lt. Dewey Riou area police commander, Andrea Griffin and Debra Thomas of the Tallahassee Neighborhood Services Department, Lisa Carey & Julianna Stanton from Beard Street and Board members Lizzie Ruse, Alexa Roche & Jim Pfost of the Neighborhood Association.MUSIC ISSUE~~The issue of loud music coming from the 2Chez outside deck area was thoroughly discussed and it was agreed that Mr. Sprowles would:(1) Instruct the bands he contracts to turn down their speaker volume to a level that entertains the customers in the 2Chez area only and does not carry into and disturb the neighborhood.(2) Make sure the music is cut off on the weekends at 11:00pm without exception.(3) Look into putting up some sort of temporary curtain or sound barrier immediately to eliminate the sound that carries directly into Beard Street from the bandstand.(4) Hire a sound engineer or consultant to determine what can be done or constructed in the deck and bandstand area to help quiet and tone down the music.(5) Try to schedule “not loud” bands in the future for more “atmosphere type music” in the deck area rather than louder music bands.
It was suggested to Lt. Riou that the decibels level or atmospheric sound level at 2 Chez be tested to determine what is acceptable so the subjective element is removed. Possibly the CIty of Tallahassee has some department that can determine these levels.
If anyone in the neighborhood still has issue with the music starting today, they should call and lodge a complaint with the Tallahassee Police Department at telephone 891-4200. Since loudness is a subjective issue, the police will make the decision whether the complaint requires a visit to the 2Chez management.
PARKING ISSUE~~
Mr. Sprowles says that Chez Pierre has about 100 parking spaces in their rear lot, 66 spaces available after hours at the TMH facility across Sixth Street and an additional 28 spaces for employee parking off site. He feels that many of the cars parking on Beard Street are not only his customers but also customers at other Mid-Town establishments. And, his rear parking lot has many cars whose owners are not at Chez Pierre but have gone to other Mid-Town Merchants.
It was suggested that Chez Pierre have an attendant checking cars and /or have a valet parking attendant so his customers do have on site parking.
As the Mid-Town Merchant area grows, it was agreed that parking is becoming a real problem. Andrea Griffin of Neighborhood Services says this is an area that the Planning Department or Growth Management need to address.
Customer cars parking on both sides of Beard Street causes a narrow lane down the middle only wide enough for one vehicle to pass through. According to Gordan Hansen of the Tallahassee Planning Department, this causes a hazard if there was a need for an emergency vehicle to drive into the neighborhood. This is something Lt. Riou feels could be remedied by the City traffic Department.
DEVIATION REQUEST~~
The Chez Pierre owners have made a Deviation Request to the Tallahassee Planning Department to move an outside cooler within 5 feet of the south property line to expand the 2CHez area. This will probably be an issue that will require “Public Notice” and public input since the 2Chez deck and awning were built without proper permits and have code violation problems.
If you have questions about these notes or any addtions, please feel free to contact me.
Thanks,
Jim Pfost |